Netflix - Making a Murderer - Steven Avery, Brendan Dassey

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These cases are suggested by forum members for research and information. Injustice Anywhere has not reviewed the details of each case and does not necessarily endorse any claims made within this section. Cases we currently advocate for can be viewed in the "Injustice Anywhere Featured Cases" section, located in the board index.

Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Dan O. » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:10 pm

Sinsaint wrote:Brendan's story is completely unrealistic.


It was enough to get him convicted. That's about as real as it gets.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Sinsaint » Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:23 pm

Dan O. wrote:
Sinsaint wrote:Brendan's story is completely unrealistic.


It was enough to get him convicted. That's about as real as it gets.


Juries have been known to get it wrong.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:49 am

Sinsaint wrote:
Dan O. wrote:ScifiTom,

You may have missed the sarcasm in my last post. The 11:43am call is the one where Teresa calls Barb Janda's number and leaves a message on her answering machine. It has also been heavily hinted that in subsequent calls Steven Avery was using *67 to hide his identity. It simply makes no sense for anyone to try and hide their identity after they initiated the contact in a very traceable way. Whether Barb's phone was registered in her name or in Steven's makes no difference. The number was left with AutoTraiders and leads back to Avery Salvage. This is where the police are going to be looking for clues. It would have been incredibly stupid for Steven to have planned a murder this way.


Actually Dan it makes a huge difference who that number traced back to. Per the report dated 11/3/05 "the number lists back to a STEVEN AVERY." These initial phone records were supplied to Weigert by MH and RH, including who the numbers were listed to. Both MH and RH stated they were doing the reverse phone number searches prior to Weigert arriving. So, who told Weigert that a number listed to Barb Janda was actually Steven Avery? Based on this phone number Colborn was sent out on the evening of 11/3/05 to the speak to not Barb Janda, the true person that phone number listed back to, but Steven Avery. There is nothing in the CASO report that explains how Steven Avery was linked to this number instantly so the only logical conclusion is that someone who supplied those records to Weigert knew more about who she visited that day than they are admitting to.


To Saint

Thank you Saint of bring the information and come on Dan, it show crystal clear that Andrew Colborn is the one who behind this mess even Lenk want to play along. I don't like Andrew Colborn and I truly think this man is a sicko even so sick that he wanted to punish Steven for the crime even get in trouble for murder and why else? Because James Lenk help him out, and it shows that, even yes Saint the police parole keep records into calls of unknown while your in jail and fail them of not giving the proof even that why Steven was in jail and it does show recording to a call is the crime and it is committed and that what Andrew Colborn did even he tried to mix the phone or something or some way. I truly believe Steven is innocent and frame, even I am still going with the pictures of abuse by her ex boyfriend. It was first his idea to look around Steven Avery junk yard. Why on earth some silly college boys want to play around a junk yard, even if they are looking for evidence, that should focus and what they did wrong with Brendan Dassey was pat him down of saying: Come on Brendan blame it on your Father! Now that a bunch of bull to me, because I an't buying it. I truly think those 2 detective screw him into school of missing classes and hide it into the Netflix.com series of that what detective love to play a dirty game!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:52 am

Sinsaint wrote:
Dan O. wrote:
Sinsaint wrote:Brendan's story is completely unrealistic.


It was enough to get him convicted. That's about as real as it gets.


Juries have been known to get it wrong.


To Saint

Yes Saint, Jury has been caught of getting it wrong. Not just wrong, one of the juried came forward to believe Steven Avery innocent and he went out of his way for it. I was glad one jury member did that and it shows, that, and Andrew Colborn was behind it, even James Lenk want to play along. I am not going to buy anything to Andrew Colborn. He should be fired of a police officer and shall be punish of this crime even it shows he guilty of crime!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Dan O. » Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:25 am

Has everyone just locked in their personal theory of what happened and letting their confirmation bias reinforce their belief with any rumor that seems to fit. You can't "know" what happened unless you can prove that there is no other possibility.

Take Steven's blood found in the RAV for instance: the theory that is being batted around is that the blood came from the rape case evidence. While this is a possibility, it is not a fact because there are other possible sources for that blood that have not been ruled out.

My involvement here is simply a personal desire to try and figure out what happened. I'm not fighting to free Steveen or Brendan though that may be the result if they are in fact innocent. A proper search for the truth follows the evidence not the beliefs? Where is that evidence being collected and organized?
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Samson » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:06 pm

Kathleen Zellner, the lawyer for Making a Murderer subject Steven Avery, is optimistic that forthcoming new episodes will portray her client in a positive light, she tells PEOPLE exclusively.

"The new Netflix episodes will reveal all of the new evidence we have developed to show Steven is innocent and was framed for a second time," Zellner says in a statement to PEOPLE.

http://www.people.com/article/making...n-steven-avery

This will be no fun for Kratz, Colborn, Lenk, Teresa's family.
That brother of Teresa's might have some demons to confront.
But the Kercher family never once expressed regret for actively and wrongfully prosecuting Amanda Knox.

There are many other cases like these. The sociology is fascinating.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Samson » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:11 pm

Dan O. wrote:Has everyone just locked in their personal theory of what happened and letting their confirmation bias reinforce their belief with any rumor that seems to fit. You can't "know" what happened unless you can prove that there is no other possibility.

Take Steven's blood found in the RAV for instance: the theory that is being batted around is that the blood came from the rape case evidence. While this is a possibility, it is not a fact because there are other possible sources for that blood that have not been ruled out.

My involvement here is simply a personal desire to try and figure out what happened. I'm not fighting to free Steveen or Brendan though that may be the result if they are in fact innocent. A proper search for the truth follows the evidence not the beliefs? Where is that evidence being collected and organized?

Are you not prepared to assume it is implausible Zellner's resources would be leading us up another garden path Dan?

Yes I can guess your answer, but I am comfortable to accept Avery's innocence is a settled matter.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Sinsaint » Wed Jul 20, 2016 5:16 pm

Dan O. wrote:Has everyone just locked in their personal theory of what happened and letting their confirmation bias reinforce their belief with any rumor that seems to fit. You can't "know" what happened unless you can prove that there is no other possibility.

Take Steven's blood found in the RAV for instance: the theory that is being batted around is that the blood came from the rape case evidence. While this is a possibility, it is not a fact because there are other possible sources for that blood that have not been ruled out.

My involvement here is simply a personal desire to try and figure out what happened. I'm not fighting to free Steveen or Brendan though that may be the result if they are in fact innocent. A proper search for the truth follows the evidence not the beliefs? Where is that evidence being collected and organized?


I haven't locked on to any theory regarding Steven Avery. For all I know he did it. Brendan is the one I'm certain had no part in this. I won't be surprised if there comes a time when his "confessions" are viewed as the perfect examples of a false confession.

I think you and I are in the safe mind frame when it comes to Steven Avery. After viewing the evidence I have a lot of questions that cannot be answered with what is available. I think, at a minimum, he should be granted a new trial.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Samson » Wed Aug 17, 2016 5:17 pm

In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Bruce Fischer » Thu Aug 18, 2016 10:47 am

Dan O. wrote:Has everyone just locked in their personal theory of what happened and letting their confirmation bias reinforce their belief with any rumor that seems to fit. You can't "know" what happened unless you can prove that there is no other possibility.

Take Steven's blood found in the RAV for instance: the theory that is being batted around is that the blood came from the rape case evidence. While this is a possibility, it is not a fact because there are other possible sources for that blood that have not been ruled out.

My involvement here is simply a personal desire to try and figure out what happened. I'm not fighting to free Steveen or Brendan though that may be the result if they are in fact innocent. A proper search for the truth follows the evidence not the beliefs? Where is that evidence being collected and organized?


Injustice Anywhere is supporting Brendan Dassey. His case is a textbook case of a false confession. There is no plausible scenario or one single piece of evidence beyond Brendan's confession, to show that he had anything at all to do with the crime.

There is a lot of mystery surrounding Steven Avery. The inconsistencies in the case, certainly provide reasonable doubt. But theories of police involvement have not yet been proven. Many questions are unanswered. I personally do not believe he committed the murder, but his path to actual innocence is far less clear than Brendan's. For me, I see no evidence of a rape or assault of any kind in Steven's trailer. I see no way that Steven cleaned up that messy garage after shooting a person in the head. They tested dozens of items in that garage and found no blood or tissue. I also find it impossible that a body was burned in that burn pit, just 6 or 7 feet away from a wooden garage. The fire would have had to have been blazing to achieve incineration of a body. I think Avery would have ended up with a charred corpse if he had tried to burn a body in that pit. Other issues raise flags as well, such as the DNA found at the quarry and the Rav4 key mysteriously showing up in Steven's trailer.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby erasmus44 » Thu Aug 18, 2016 11:15 am

Samson wrote:In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/



It is important to recognize that there are 2 reasons that involuntary confessions are inadmissible in criminal proceedings. The first is to deter the police from engaging in coercive interrogation techniques. But the second is just as important - involuntary confessions are inherently unreliable. In this case, I can't imagine anyone who is playing with a full deck of cards watching the tapes of the interrogation and reaching the conclusion that the results of the interrogation are reliable evidence of ANYTHING.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Chris_Halkides » Thu Aug 18, 2016 4:28 pm

"Of course, Dassey's legal case is also completely separate from Avery's, as they were prosecuted separately for Halbach's murder. In fact, Avery was prosecuted first as the sole perpetrator of Halbach's murder. 'One man and one man only' was to blame, Prosecutor Kenneth Kratz memorably declared at Avery's trial – a stark contrast to the televised press conference he had given following Dassey's coerced confession the year before, in which he described both defendants raping and murdering Halbach in lurid detail."

"'If a prosecution presents inconsistent and irreconcilable theories to two different juries on the same crime, it's indisputable that at least one of those trials is not a search for the truth,' Avery's trial attorney Dean Strang told Rolling Stone earlier this year. 'If one narrative is true, the other one can't be true and if you're presenting both of them, at least in one of those trials, you're not on a search for the truth. And a fair question is whether, in either trial, they're in search of the truth or just two convictions.'"
http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/fea ... ry-w434421

The problem of having two narratives is another reason to examine these two cases. One wishes that some kind of reform to prevent this kind of tap dancing could be crafted, but offhand I don't see how.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Sinsaint » Fri Aug 19, 2016 12:34 am

Samson wrote:In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/


She still thinks the Duke Lacrosse players gang raped a woman so... yeah.
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Dan O. » Fri Aug 19, 2016 6:45 am

Bruce Fischer wrote:Injustice Anywhere is supporting Brendan Dassey.

How far does that support go? Theories of possible criminal involvement of certain police officers are batted around this site with no actual supporting evidence. Would similar theories of Breendan's involvement be permitted?

His case is a textbook case of a false confession. There is no plausible scenario or one single piece of evidence beyond Brendan's confession, to show that he had anything at all to do with the crime.

I would actually prefer that this case not be used as the textbook example of a false confession. It reinforces the beliefe that false confessions only happen when there is a mental deficiency.

There is a lot of mystery surrounding Steven Avery. The inconsistencies in the case, certainly provide reasonable doubt. But theories of police involvement have not yet been proven. Many questions are unanswered. I personally do not believe he committed the murder, but his path to actual innocence is far less clear than Brendan's. For me, I see no evidence of a rape or assault of any kind in Steven's trailer. I see no way that Steven cleaned up that messy garage after shooting a person in the head. They tested dozens of items in that garage and found no blood or tissue. I also find it impossible that a body was burned in that burn pit, just 6 or 7 feet away from a wooden garage. The fire would have had to have been blazing to achieve incineration of a body. I think Avery would have ended up with a charred corpse if he had tried to burn a body in that pit. Other issues raise flags as well, such as the DNA found at the quarry and the Rav4 key mysteriously showing up in Steven's trailer.


Have you got a plausible explanation for the DNA found on the bullet fragment from the garage that doesn't confirm Brendan's confession AND doesn't involve malfeasance on the part of the police?
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 19, 2016 7:34 am

Samson wrote:In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/


To Sam

Hey Sam, thanks for the article, even I an't going to buy Nancy Grace one bit. I really don't like this gal even I think she a psycho girl who doesn't understand criminal law, even I disagree with her of every detail. The one I truly trust is on GMA morning and he very good and he does a show with Nancy Grace, and every time Nancy Grace believes into guilt of not knowing criminal law and I an't buying her period!!!

P. S. she believes Amanda Knox was guilty of crime too, and Kirstin Lobato. She never study criminal law. I support 5 people who are innocent, and those are 2 of them. But I am going with my own website wages of freedom into the near future with my Anne Hathaway style and why I believe if Anne does care for a heart of innocent, and you got to trust the innocent more then guilt. You know if Nancy did had a heart of love. She does need to learn it!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 19, 2016 7:38 am

Sinsaint wrote:
Samson wrote:In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/


She still thinks the Duke Lacrosse players gang raped a woman so... yeah.


To Saint

Hey Saint if you ever heard of Jon Stewart did to her, of the joke on her into the Duke gang rape the woman. Jon Stewart believe the Duke team was wrongful convicted of rape and he believe they are innocent of this crime. I enjoy watching Jon Stewart so many times of making fun of Nancy Grace!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 19, 2016 7:42 am

erasmus44 wrote:
Samson wrote:In a surprise :winks: development Nancy Grace thinks Brendan's interrogation was good and he belongs in jail.

http://www.thewrap.com/making-a-murd...rendan-dassey/



It is important to recognize that there are 2 reasons that involuntary confessions are inadmissible in criminal proceedings. The first is to deter the police from engaging in coercive interrogation techniques. But the second is just as important - involuntary confessions are inherently unreliable. In this case, I can't imagine anyone who is playing with a full deck of cards watching the tapes of the interrogation and reaching the conclusion that the results of the interrogation are reliable evidence of ANYTHING.


To Erasmus44

I agree with you Erasmus44 and you said it better then anyone else!!!

:worthy: :worthy: :worthy: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:26 am

Dan O. wrote:Has everyone just locked in their personal theory of what happened and letting their confirmation bias reinforce their belief with any rumor that seems to fit. You can't "know" what happened unless you can prove that there is no other possibility.

Take Steven's blood found in the RAV for instance: the theory that is being batted around is that the blood came from the rape case evidence. While this is a possibility, it is not a fact because there are other possible sources for that blood that have not been ruled out.

My involvement here is simply a personal desire to try and figure out what happened. I'm not fighting to free Steveen or Brendan though that may be the result if they are in fact innocent. A proper search for the truth follows the evidence not the beliefs? Where is that evidence being collected and organized?


To Dan

Come on Dan, use your head, even I know it does sound guilty into a crime wave, of theories. But to me I truly think this is a mystery or something is not right, that is fix. I believe Steven Avery is innocent with Brendan Dassey and the way I see it go is this, that in the beginning of Netflix: Making a murder. He was first wrongful convicted of rape and it kindly silly that he spent 18yrs of jail, and he was free until a new case called: Theresa Halbach and he was charge of the crime and why on earth 2 silly boys who close friend want to check a junk yard. Oh who is it scary like Scooby Doo show.

My god no it isn't! I truly think both men were innocent and this case is like a no way ghost story. I know you and me go different ways. I believe Andrew Colborn frame him and you go different, even you think of James Lenk. I know there some good cops and yes some bad cops!!!

It ok Dan you don't have to fight to free both of them. But I am going to fight to free both of them, even I believe different, and why on earth are you asking like this. I fight for the innocent even I believe more innocent of 4 more cases of a totally of 5 cases. I am not positive of there innocent. But I believe they were wrongful convicted of murder even yes he sound like he did it. But I really like evidence of unknown. But they got to test the DNA of evidence even isn't that odd too!!!

Let wait until Katherine Zellner find anything new, and maybe she will even let face it. She was good with Ryan Ferguson case and he won and prove his innocent! But I am here for both of them!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:42 am

Bruce Fischer wrote:There is a lot of mystery surrounding Steven Avery. The inconsistencies in the case, certainly provide reasonable doubt. But theories of police involvement have not yet been proven. Many questions are unanswered. I personally do not believe he committed the murder, but his path to actual innocence is far less clear than Brendan's. For me, I see no evidence of a rape or assault of any kind in Steven's trailer. I see no way that Steven cleaned up that messy garage after shooting a person in the head. They tested dozens of items in that garage and found no blood or tissue. I also find it impossible that a body was burned in that burn pit, just 6 or 7 feet away from a wooden garage. The fire would have had to have been blazing to achieve incineration of a body. I think Avery would have ended up with a charred corpse if he had tried to burn a body in that pit. Other issues raise flags as well, such as the DNA found at the quarry and the Rav4 key mysteriously showing up in Steven's trailer.


To Bruce

Hey Bruce in my own opinion, I know it sound guilty that fit the crime of Steven Avery. But also it is mystery as well of into a ghost town or ghost hunters of impossible style. I think Steven Avery is charge of animal abuse of burning a dog or some animal of why it died, even it my guts feeling of that way, even I just don't believe he charge of murder even it would be impossible to burn the body, unless you watch the movie Star Wars: Return of the Jedi when Luke Skywalker burn his Father, of unknown. Ok maybe it sound guilt. But I am going with my guts feeling that some how this is 2 theory of Ghost hunters or Scooby Doo style. It just me, into a criminal law. I believe into innocent of crime wave!!!

But I do agree with you that Brendan Dassey was wrongful convicted of false and he has nothing to do with this crime, even I truly believe he might didn't want that Doggy died of unknown and maybe he lost, even what they did to him was plan stupid of nonsense of 2 against 1 and it plan stupid of a false confession. I am against of 2 people vs 1 person. I an't buying it and it a bullied crime of were I stand!!!

I really would like what Katherine Zellner has for us in stores and see if he is innocent some way!!!
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Re: Netflix "Making a Murderer" Discussion

Postby Sinsaint » Fri Aug 19, 2016 2:58 pm

Dan O. wrote:How far does that support go? Theories of possible criminal involvement of certain police officers are batted around this site with no actual supporting evidence. Would similar theories of Breendan's involvement be permitted?


You are confusing the two cases. The arguments being made about Dassey's conviction have nothing to do with any criminal behavior on the part of LE. It involves the issue of a clearly coerced and false confession.

I would actually prefer that this case not be used as the textbook example of a false confession. It reinforces the beliefe that false confessions only happen when there is a mental deficiency.


It certainly reinforces the fact that that a sixteen year old child with intellectual disabilities would be highly inclined to give a false confession when using dubious interrogation tactics but nowhere does it preclude able-minded adults from caving to the same pressures.

Have you got a plausible explanation for the DNA found on the bullet fragment from the garage that doesn't confirm Brendan's confession AND doesn't involve malfeasance on the part of the police?


To paraphrase LE... "I'm just gonna come right out and ask you, who shot her in the head."

The problem with your question is the erroneous assumption Brendan stated she was shot in the head. Later in the interrogation when asked why he didn't just tell investigators she was shot in the head his response was "I couldn't think of it." Anyone who views the confession with objectivity can see that Brendan never suggested she was shot in the head. He simply agree after being told she was. And to further prove that point Brendan even said he couldn't think of. For a kid who supposedly witnessed her murder he certainly would have remembered her being shot.

The hood latch DNA is yet another example of people manipulating the facts to claim Brendan's revelation about his uncle lifting the hood during his confession is supported by the fact SA's DNA was found there. In actuality Fassbender asked Brendan repeatedly what SA was doing under the hood to which Brendan replied "I don't know." That's not Brendan saying SA was under the hood. That's an investigator telling him that. All the hood latch DNA did was confirm Fassbender's statements, not Brendan's.

But getting back to the bullet. The simple answer is cross contamination along with a lab employee breaking protocol to report results that under any other circumstance would have been reported as inconclusive.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby ScifiTom » Fri Aug 26, 2016 9:55 am

To everyone

Hey everyone, as knowing we have to wait for another day or another month of unknown, even why to long of unknown that is right that supports of Steven Avery & Brendan Dassey came out of no where, to keep the faith alive and like a promise this case is a huge mess up even something is not right!!!

http://www.nbc26.com/news/steven-averys ... achs-death

Still no word on about Katherine Zellner and we got to wait again. I am positive that Katherine Zellner has something for us, even it a theory. But which way is it going and were it coming too!!!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby jane » Sat Aug 27, 2016 5:36 am

ScifiTom wrote:To everyone

Hey everyone, as knowing we have to wait for another day or another month of unknown, even why to long of unknown that is right that supports of Steven Avery & Brendan Dassey came out of no where, to keep the faith alive and like a promise this case is a huge mess up even something is not right!!!

http://www.nbc26.com/news/steven-averys ... achs-death

Still no word on about Katherine Zellner and we got to wait again. I am positive that Katherine Zellner has something for us, even it a theory. But which way is it going and were it coming too!!!


Here it is:


http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/new ... ed-w436412

"Mr. Avery is requesting, and is willing to pay for, the most comprehensive, thorough, and advanced forensic testing ever requested by a criminal defendant in the State of Wisconsin," Zellner told reporters outside the Manitowoc County Courthouse.
The 45-page motion requests that many pieces of evidence be tested for DNA, including the hood latch on Halbach’s RAV4 and the key to the vehicle found inside Avery’s trailer by Manitowoc County Sheriff’s officers. According to the motion, "more sensitive forensic DNA techniques have been developed that can recover sufficient DNA for profiling from…fingerprints." Zellner has also requested fingerprints from Andrew Colborn and James Lenk, the two Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department deputies who have long been suspected of planting evidence to frame Avery.............
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby ScifiTom » Sat Aug 27, 2016 7:46 am

jane wrote:
ScifiTom wrote:To everyone

Hey everyone, as knowing we have to wait for another day or another month of unknown, even why to long of unknown that is right that supports of Steven Avery & Brendan Dassey came out of no where, to keep the faith alive and like a promise this case is a huge mess up even something is not right!!!

http://www.nbc26.com/news/steven-averys ... achs-death

Still no word on about Katherine Zellner and we got to wait again. I am positive that Katherine Zellner has something for us, even it a theory. But which way is it going and were it coming too!!!


Here it is:


http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/new ... ed-w436412

"Mr. Avery is requesting, and is willing to pay for, the most comprehensive, thorough, and advanced forensic testing ever requested by a criminal defendant in the State of Wisconsin," Zellner told reporters outside the Manitowoc County Courthouse.
The 45-page motion requests that many pieces of evidence be tested for DNA, including the hood latch on Halbach’s RAV4 and the key to the vehicle found inside Avery’s trailer by Manitowoc County Sheriff’s officers. According to the motion, "more sensitive forensic DNA techniques have been developed that can recover sufficient DNA for profiling from…fingerprints." Zellner has also requested fingerprints from Andrew Colborn and James Lenk, the two Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department deputies who have long been suspected of planting evidence to frame Avery.............


To Jane

Thank you Jane, for the information and I will make a new topic right now of Katherine Zellner Theory and detail of the case and every issue of it. So thanks again for this and talk to you soon Jane!!!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:08 am

Wayward son suggests this on ISF.

What do you all think here?? Charlie?

....................................................................................................................................................

I originally thought that was the case after reading the motion, but I have changed my mind. I think that it is more than possible that KZ wants those two to think that they are the main murder suspects. remember she said that she had one suspect that was way out in front, but she didn't want to scare him or make him run? I think that she feels that these two either willingly or unwittingly helped plant evidence and she wants to make them worried that either one could get pinned for the murder. What are the chances that their DNA, finger prints etc don't show up somewhere if they helped plant the evidence? I would say that it wouldn't look good, and if they already know that the LEOs could frame someone for this murder, then certainly those same LEOs would let either of them take the fall. I would start to sweat. I would probably be singing pretty quickly.

How is this for a scenario:

TH is reported missing on Nov 3rd.
At 6:30pm Wiegert calls Colborn to check Avery and Zipperer. Colborn first calls Lenk at 6:32 for unknown reasons. And I can imagine that Colborn instantly thinks to himself....what are the chances that SA could have kidnapped or killed TH? It would be like wining the lottery. The problems would be gone. In the back of his mind Colborn is hoping that TH is dead and SA killed her. Naturally, he goes to SA's first, talks to SA. Leaves heads towards Zipperer's doesn't bother to stop, and meets up with Lenk, Remiker and Dedering at 7pm at the MTSO.

From that time until 10pm when Colborn joined Remiker and Dedering at Zipperers, we have no idea what Colborn (or Lenk is doing). We do know that at some time this evening Colborn called in the plate. Colborn says that he arrived home around 10:30-11pm.

So we have almost 3 hours of which we know that Colborn was working the case, with only two tasks stop at SA and Zips, with the first already done, and the second not until he met up with two other officers at 10.

So my scenario. Colborn and Lenk head back to SA's. They want to check out all around there. SA sees tail-lights around 8 pm around the back of the property. Colborn (or C+L) find the RAV4 and the burn/bones in the quarry. They contact, the owner of the property JR, he arrives quickly. Holy crap. Colborn and Lenk say to him that they know the killer is SA, but as SA has recently been exonerated and has a lot of sympathy within the community it will really hard to convict him. Especially as the body and vehicle were found in JR's quarry; he could be the one going down for this if they can't prove SA's guilt. They come up with the plan to help ease the case towards justice - moving the vehicle and bones etc to SA's property. JR believes that SA is guilty because Lenk and Colborn assure him that is the case. He believes he is helping ensure that a monster is convicted. Lenk and Colborn don't know or care if SA is guilty - he might be - but regardless they will make it look that way because that is the outcome they want...and in a way they kind of feel that it is cosmic justice. They wronged SA, but psychologically people don't accept that kind of thing. They feel that SA must have deserved what happened to him before, and he deserves this too. JR helps move the vehicle and/or the bones in the coming days. He enters the property three times after it is blocked off to the public. Essentially he is scared, thinks that he is helping the police get a terrible murderer off the street, and just doing whatever Lenk and Colborn ask.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Pickles » Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:17 am

He also is the first to mention A FIRE, giving a statement that he saw it around 4:30 on Oct 31 coming from a burn barrel behind (or near) Steven Avery's garage. This is something that Zellner thinks is impossible given where JR says he was standing on his property when he saw the fire. She has also mentioned in the past that a fire that close to the garage would have damaged the building. What's interesting is that despite being the first one to ever mention anything about a fire and giving a statement, JR is never called to testify by the state. Why not? Did he screw up by saying he saw the fire in the barrel and not the burn pit? Was evidence mistakenly planted in the burn pit, or in the wrong barrel, and not the one he said he saw in fire? Did they all of a sudden realize it would be impossible for anyone to see a fire in that barrel from JR's property?

I think something happened on his property. I don't know if he was responsible or if LE convinced him to cooperate. JR's family owns every parcel of land surrounding the Avery property, and the families have had issues/land disputes in the past. Don't think Zellner is necessarily pointing the finger at JR or TH's ex boyfriend, Ryan, (she mentions him in the motion too) but she does seem to be trying to smoke these two guys out.

The entire motion can be found here... http://www.stevenaverycase.org/miscellaneous-records/

I usually post and read on the Reddit forums (TickTockManitowoc and StevenAveryIsGuilty) , but very much enjoy reading everyone's perspectives here!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Pickles » Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:39 am

Not sure if I will be able to edit my post, but I wanted to correct what I said about JR's family owning the land around Avery Salvage or having disputes w/the Averys. My mistake... this is all owned by an LLC not the Radants. Sorry for any confusion.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby charlie_wilkes » Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:59 am

Samson wrote:Wayward son suggests this on ISF.

What do you all think here?? Charlie?

....................................................................................................................................................

I originally thought that was the case after reading the motion, but I have changed my mind. I think that it is more than possible that KZ wants those two to think that they are the main murder suspects. remember she said that she had one suspect that was way out in front, but she didn't want to scare him or make him run? I think that she feels that these two either willingly or unwittingly helped plant evidence and she wants to make them worried that either one could get pinned for the murder. What are the chances that their DNA, finger prints etc don't show up somewhere if they helped plant the evidence? I would say that it wouldn't look good, and if they already know that the LEOs could frame someone for this murder, then certainly those same LEOs would let either of them take the fall. I would start to sweat. I would probably be singing pretty quickly.

How is this for a scenario:

TH is reported missing on Nov 3rd.
At 6:30pm Wiegert calls Colborn to check Avery and Zipperer. Colborn first calls Lenk at 6:32 for unknown reasons. And I can imagine that Colborn instantly thinks to himself....what are the chances that SA could have kidnapped or killed TH? It would be like wining the lottery. The problems would be gone. In the back of his mind Colborn is hoping that TH is dead and SA killed her. Naturally, he goes to SA's first, talks to SA. Leaves heads towards Zipperer's doesn't bother to stop, and meets up with Lenk, Remiker and Dedering at 7pm at the MTSO.

From that time until 10pm when Colborn joined Remiker and Dedering at Zipperers, we have no idea what Colborn (or Lenk is doing). We do know that at some time this evening Colborn called in the plate. Colborn says that he arrived home around 10:30-11pm.

So we have almost 3 hours of which we know that Colborn was working the case, with only two tasks stop at SA and Zips, with the first already done, and the second not until he met up with two other officers at 10.

So my scenario. Colborn and Lenk head back to SA's. They want to check out all around there. SA sees tail-lights around 8 pm around the back of the property. Colborn (or C+L) find the RAV4 and the burn/bones in the quarry. They contact, the owner of the property JR, he arrives quickly. Holy crap. Colborn and Lenk say to him that they know the killer is SA, but as SA has recently been exonerated and has a lot of sympathy within the community it will really hard to convict him. Especially as the body and vehicle were found in JR's quarry; he could be the one going down for this if they can't prove SA's guilt. They come up with the plan to help ease the case towards justice - moving the vehicle and bones etc to SA's property. JR believes that SA is guilty because Lenk and Colborn assure him that is the case. He believes he is helping ensure that a monster is convicted. Lenk and Colborn don't know or care if SA is guilty - he might be - but regardless they will make it look that way because that is the outcome they want...and in a way they kind of feel that it is cosmic justice. They wronged SA, but psychologically people don't accept that kind of thing. They feel that SA must have deserved what happened to him before, and he deserves this too. JR helps move the vehicle and/or the bones in the coming days. He enters the property three times after it is blocked off to the public. Essentially he is scared, thinks that he is helping the police get a terrible murderer off the street, and just doing whatever Lenk and Colborn ask.


Interesting analysis, but it leaves open the question of who committed the murder and incinerated the body.

Oh well. We're getting there. I agree that Zellner aims to flush out Radandt and Hillegas, both of whom are up to their necks in this.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:59 am

charlie_wilkes wrote:
Samson wrote:Wayward son suggests this on ISF.

What do you all think here?? Charlie?

....................................................................................................................................................

I originally thought that was the case after reading the motion, but I have changed my mind. I think that it is more than possible that KZ wants those two to think that they are the main murder suspects. remember she said that she had one suspect that was way out in front, but she didn't want to scare him or make him run? I think that she feels that these two either willingly or unwittingly helped plant evidence and she wants to make them worried that either one could get pinned for the murder. What are the chances that their DNA, finger prints etc don't show up somewhere if they helped plant the evidence? I would say that it wouldn't look good, and if they already know that the LEOs could frame someone for this murder, then certainly those same LEOs would let either of them take the fall. I would start to sweat. I would probably be singing pretty quickly.

How is this for a scenario:

TH is reported missing on Nov 3rd.
At 6:30pm Wiegert calls Colborn to check Avery and Zipperer. Colborn first calls Lenk at 6:32 for unknown reasons. And I can imagine that Colborn instantly thinks to himself....what are the chances that SA could have kidnapped or killed TH? It would be like wining the lottery. The problems would be gone. In the back of his mind Colborn is hoping that TH is dead and SA killed her. Naturally, he goes to SA's first, talks to SA. Leaves heads towards Zipperer's doesn't bother to stop, and meets up with Lenk, Remiker and Dedering at 7pm at the MTSO.

From that time until 10pm when Colborn joined Remiker and Dedering at Zipperers, we have no idea what Colborn (or Lenk is doing). We do know that at some time this evening Colborn called in the plate. Colborn says that he arrived home around 10:30-11pm.

So we have almost 3 hours of which we know that Colborn was working the case, with only two tasks stop at SA and Zips, with the first already done, and the second not until he met up with two other officers at 10.

So my scenario. Colborn and Lenk head back to SA's. They want to check out all around there. SA sees tail-lights around 8 pm around the back of the property. Colborn (or C+L) find the RAV4 and the burn/bones in the quarry. They contact, the owner of the property JR, he arrives quickly. Holy crap. Colborn and Lenk say to him that they know the killer is SA, but as SA has recently been exonerated and has a lot of sympathy within the community it will really hard to convict him. Especially as the body and vehicle were found in JR's quarry; he could be the one going down for this if they can't prove SA's guilt. They come up with the plan to help ease the case towards justice - moving the vehicle and bones etc to SA's property. JR believes that SA is guilty because Lenk and Colborn assure him that is the case. He believes he is helping ensure that a monster is convicted. Lenk and Colborn don't know or care if SA is guilty - he might be - but regardless they will make it look that way because that is the outcome they want...and in a way they kind of feel that it is cosmic justice. They wronged SA, but psychologically people don't accept that kind of thing. They feel that SA must have deserved what happened to him before, and he deserves this too. JR helps move the vehicle and/or the bones in the coming days. He enters the property three times after it is blocked off to the public. Essentially he is scared, thinks that he is helping the police get a terrible murderer off the street, and just doing whatever Lenk and Colborn ask.


Interesting analysis, but it leaves open the question of who committed the murder and incinerated the body.

Oh well. We're getting there. I agree that Zellner aims to flush out Radandt and Hillegas, both of whom are up to their necks in this.

It seems we are still looking at the deleted phone calls.

This entails also accepting the amazing coincidence as being causally detached.

1. Steven Avery has the Manitowoc County in thrall
2. All of a sudden a young woman last seen with Avery disappears.

I can't begin to put those undisputed facts into a narrative that adds up, so it is over to Zellner.

Coincidences do occur all the time, it is statistical clustering and by no means uncommon, so I am bound to accept this may be one of those.
Hmm, we must follow the facts, not our fondly held theories.

ETA

Follow

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Crucial witnesses coming forward now-as they always do when new scientific testing sought. Science not spin will rule.

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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby ScifiTom » Mon Sep 05, 2016 8:25 am

To everyone

Hey everyone, as knowing I still blaming Andrew Colborn has something to do with this murder case and he the one that I believe he killed her and frame Steven Avery of it, even it odd me, out of the lies he said and this nonsense of him noting doing any contact of looking for a body even that is odd and there is other theory into this case and here is that article right now!!!

http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/lis ... es-w437757

You don't have to agree with me, even I just don't like Andrew Colborn one bit and he hiding something, even he knows something or someone of unknown even 2 of the attorney catch him in the act of playing a dumb game of nonsense. I just don't buy this cop one bit!!!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby LordYam » Thu Sep 15, 2016 10:01 pm

I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey killed Theresa. It would explain why Brandan waffled; he didn't want to convict his stepdad and brother
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Bruce Fischer » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:18 am

LordYam wrote:I think Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey killed Theresa. It would explain why Brandan waffled; he didn't want to convict his stepdad and brother


Do you have any proof to back up your scenario, or is it just a hunch?
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby LordYam » Sat Sep 17, 2016 4:57 pm

Educated guess. Scott openly hated Steven has a history of violence against women and tried to sell a .22 rifle the week of the killing. Bobby had marks on his back he claimed were left by a puppy. Both are the only alibi the other has.

Hypothetical
Theresa leaves. Scott and Bobby follow and kill her. They plant the remains in Steven's pit. Then they just sit back and watch the fireworks.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Tue Sep 20, 2016 1:31 am

LordYam wrote:Educated guess. Scott openly hated Steven has a history of violence against women and tried to sell a .22 rifle the week of the killing. Bobby had marks on his back he claimed were left by a puppy. Both are the only alibi the other has.

Hypothetical
Theresa leaves. Scott and Bobby follow and kill her. They plant the remains in Steven's pit. Then they just sit back and watch the fireworks.

A few more actions needed though.
It does appear ex boyfriend Ryan Hillegas is in trouble, but how did the cops tie up with him? Did the cops know he was the killer, or did he brazenly tell them Steve was the man? 22 calls from him to the cops after Teresa disappeared I think I read. That would explain why the cops could announce she was murdered. He told them where he "discovered" her burned body.
Most importantly, was this just the luckiest event ever to happen completely independently of trouble with the 36 million?
Wut? Something is wrong.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:05 pm

An interesting link

http://www.postcrescent.com/story/news/ ... /89669586/

"The Holy Grail is to find an alternative suspect," suggested Daniel Medwed, law professor at Northeastern University in Boston. "Developing the case of a plausible other suspect after the trial ... it's about showing new evidence that creates a probability of a different result. For every crime, there is a true perpetrator who is out there."

For example I believe Lundy is stuck until a proper effort is made to do this, not a moronic attempt to implicate the brother in law.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Sat Nov 05, 2016 4:00 am

I think patterns are not described in a cogent way in these obvious miscarriages of justice, patterns rule everything in the universe, so I was fascinated to read Strang say

Strang said part of that decision came from a "hunch", but experience paved the way.

"It's enormously persuasive that this guy simply never said anything that suggested he did it," Strang said.

"He's not the sharpest knife in the drawer. For sixteen months his every word, literally, every word was recorded, and there was never a hint or suggestion or veiled comment that remotely suggested guilt.

"That's terribly shaky, it shakes me a great deal because my experience has been that guilty clients just confess. To me, to police, to somebody. That's what happens. It never happened here and that's unnerving.


http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainm...ectid=11742926
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:56 pm

Brendan Dassey is to be freed.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/15/us/br ... .html?_r=0

Another milestone.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Driver-X » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:24 pm

Has anyone touched on the fact that:

1) The police dispatch call that positively Identified Theresa's car down to the license plate number days before it turned up in Avery's salvage yard.
2) The fact that there was not one shred of DNA found in the home or the garage where she was supposedly killed.
3) Steven's DNA evidence in the first trail which was kept was tampered with in a way that tells me a syringe was inserted to extract blood which I believe no matter what the FBI claims was used in Theresa's vehicle to Frame Steven.
4)It took 7 separate searches to find the bullet that killed Theresa which by the way is unprecedented in terms of searches because after a search the property is supposed to be released back to its owner which did not happen.
5)how is it that a bullet is found with the victims DNA on it but the rest of the garage is spotless,I mean not one drop of blood was found anywhere not even under the concrete that they removed from the floor which would be scientifically impossible if that truly was the crime scene.
6) The car key, again several searches of the home produced A)absolutely no DNA which again is scientifically impossible if they held her in the house before they killed her,and B) how is it it took several searches to turn up Theresa's car key

I'm sorry but the two defendants were setup by corrupt cops who If I was a lawyer would have crushed during cross-examination especially the dispatch call and the fact that there wasn't a shred of DNA evidence in the house or the garage.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby geebee2 » Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:32 am

Driver-X wrote:Has anyone touched on the fact that:

1) The police dispatch call that positively Identified Theresa's car down to the license plate number days before it turned up in Avery's salvage yard.
2) The fact that there was not one shred of DNA found in the home or the garage where she was supposedly killed.
3) Steven's DNA evidence in the first trail which was kept was tampered with in a way that tells me a syringe was inserted to extract blood which I believe no matter what the FBI claims was used in Theresa's vehicle to Frame Steven.
4)It took 7 separate searches to find the bullet that killed Theresa which by the way is unprecedented in terms of searches because after a search the property is supposed to be released back to its owner which did not happen.
5)how is it that a bullet is found with the victims DNA on it but the rest of the garage is spotless,I mean not one drop of blood was found anywhere not even under the concrete that they removed from the floor which would be scientifically impossible if that truly was the crime scene.
6) The car key, again several searches of the home produced A)absolutely no DNA which again is scientifically impossible if they held her in the house before they killed her,and B) how is it it took several searches to turn up Theresa's car key

I'm sorry but the two defendants were setup by corrupt cops who If I was a lawyer would have crushed during cross-examination especially the dispatch call and the fact that there wasn't a shred of DNA evidence in the house or the garage.


I agree the evidence is very questionable, but I don't believe cops carried out the setup, the evidence points in another direction, to serial killer Edward Wayne Edwards. He performed many murders and setups, such as Laci Peterson / Scott Peterson. A new docu-series is coming, see

http://wbay.com/2016/11/16/manitowoc-co ... d-edwards/
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Oakshallis » Fri Dec 02, 2016 6:59 am

A Lawyers doesent care about what's truthful. What he cares about is, what should have happened d, what could have happend. That's it's own kind of truth....
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby ScifiTom » Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:34 pm

To Everyone

Hey everyone, I just got breaking news right now that there is no word on Brendan Dassey case, even the case went to Chicago Illinois court of Judge pannel and right now, no word on it!!!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Sat Mar 18, 2017 1:50 am

I am reading Jerry Buting's book on kindle.
Shaun Attwood in his book makes a suggestion that meth fueled drug dealers did the crime.
This could well be so. What needs to be resolved is the coincidence involved, just in time delivery I guess might be an analogy. I have just got to Colborn and Lenk in Buting, so I can't spoil any plot. Buting's book is serious and details other cases.
Both books are on kindle

Unmaking a murderer by Shaun Attwood

Illusion of Justice by Jerry Buting.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby McGirr » Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:52 am

Samson wrote:I am reading Jerry Buting's book on kindle.
Shaun Attwood in his book makes a suggestion that meth fueled drug dealers did the crime.
This could well be so. What needs to be resolved is the coincidence involved, just in time delivery I guess might be an analogy. I have just got to Colborn and Lenk in Buting, so I can't spoil any plot. Buting's book is serious and details other cases.
Both books are on kindle

Unmaking a murderer by Shaun Attwood

Illusion of Justice by Jerry Buting.


Thanks Samson, Will give those a read.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Tue Mar 21, 2017 5:27 pm

McGirr wrote:
Samson wrote:I am reading Jerry Buting's book on kindle.
Shaun Attwood in his book makes a suggestion that meth fueled drug dealers did the crime.
This could well be so. What needs to be resolved is the coincidence involved, just in time delivery I guess might be an analogy. I have just got to Colborn and Lenk in Buting, so I can't spoil any plot. Buting's book is serious and details other cases.
Both books are on kindle

Unmaking a murderer by Shaun Attwood

Illusion of Justice by Jerry Buting.


Thanks Samson, Will give those a read.

This passage from Buting is a rather engaging curiosity.

................................

And speaking with a Green Bay television reporter, Sheriff Peterson had dismissed the notion that Avery had been framed by saying, “If we wanted to eliminate Steve, it would’ve been a whole lot easier to eliminate Steve than to frame Steve.” The reporter apparently had a hard time believing what she was hearing and asked what he meant by “eliminate.” Sheriff Peterson obligingly explained. “If we wanted him killed, it would be much easier to kill him.”
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby ScifiTom » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:11 am

Samson wrote:I am reading Jerry Buting's book on kindle.
Shaun Attwood in his book makes a suggestion that meth fueled drug dealers did the crime.
This could well be so. What needs to be resolved is the coincidence involved, just in time delivery I guess might be an analogy. I have just got to Colborn and Lenk in Buting, so I can't spoil any plot. Buting's book is serious and details other cases.
Both books are on kindle

Unmaking a murderer by Shaun Attwood

Illusion of Justice by Jerry Buting.


To Sam

Thank you Sam, for the information and yes I am looking forward of reading both book. But I would first read Shaun Attwood, then Jerry Buting. But I am already reading Robert F Kennedy novel about Michael Skakel.

But anyway I am going set my mind off on Steven Avery, Brendan Dassey & Michael Skakel and focus on 2 cases even that my goal of right now. I will read 2 book of see which one is good, even Sam you can join me in the fight of free the innocent 2 of Kirstin B. Lobato & Dustin A. Turner case!!!

P. S. Jerry Buting was on Dr Phil show and I didn't enjoy it very much. Dr Phil was trying to be a jerk of guilty party and I just didn't like it when Ken Kratz was there too of talking about his book as well. But Jerry Buting book is way better and I assure it prove his innocent of wrongful convicted of murder and that all Sam and talk to you soon Sam!!!
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby Samson » Tue Apr 04, 2017 4:25 am

ScifiTom wrote:
Samson wrote:I am reading Jerry Buting's book on kindle.
Shaun Attwood in his book makes a suggestion that meth fueled drug dealers did the crime.
This could well be so. What needs to be resolved is the coincidence involved, just in time delivery I guess might be an analogy. I have just got to Colborn and Lenk in Buting, so I can't spoil any plot. Buting's book is serious and details other cases.
Both books are on kindle

Unmaking a murderer by Shaun Attwood

Illusion of Justice by Jerry Buting.


To Sam

Thank you Sam, for the information and yes I am looking forward of reading both book. But I would first read Shaun Attwood, then Jerry Buting. But I am already reading Robert F Kennedy novel about Michael Skakel.

But anyway I am going set my mind off on Steven Avery, Brendan Dassey & Michael Skakel and focus on 2 cases even that my goal of right now. I will read 2 book of see which one is good, even Sam you can join me in the fight of free the innocent 2 of Kirstin B. Lobato & Dustin A. Turner case!!!

P. S. Jerry Buting was on Dr Phil show and I didn't enjoy it very much. Dr Phil was trying to be a jerk of guilty party and I just didn't like it when Ken Kratz was there too of talking about his book as well. But Jerry Buting book is way better and I assure it prove his innocent of wrongful convicted of murder and that all Sam and talk to you soon Sam!!!

Tom, I am glad you will read Jerry's book. Jerome in fact, lovely name.

https://www.amazon.com/Illusion-Justice ... of+justice

$16.39

Jerome is a good man in every sense of the word, or so he appears.
Justice is an issue not a word. Find one issue that isn't fair and change that, and that's justice.
Samson
 
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby erasmus44 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:19 am

geebee2 wrote:
Driver-X wrote:Has anyone touched on the fact that:

1) The police dispatch call that positively Identified Theresa's car down to the license plate number days before it turned up in Avery's salvage yard.
2) The fact that there was not one shred of DNA found in the home or the garage where she was supposedly killed.
3) Steven's DNA evidence in the first trail which was kept was tampered with in a way that tells me a syringe was inserted to extract blood which I believe no matter what the FBI claims was used in Theresa's vehicle to Frame Steven.
4)It took 7 separate searches to find the bullet that killed Theresa which by the way is unprecedented in terms of searches because after a search the property is supposed to be released back to its owner which did not happen.
5)how is it that a bullet is found with the victims DNA on it but the rest of the garage is spotless,I mean not one drop of blood was found anywhere not even under the concrete that they removed from the floor which would be scientifically impossible if that truly was the crime scene.
6) The car key, again several searches of the home produced A)absolutely no DNA which again is scientifically impossible if they held her in the house before they killed her,and B) how is it it took several searches to turn up Theresa's car key

I'm sorry but the two defendants were setup by corrupt cops who If I was a lawyer would have crushed during cross-examination especially the dispatch call and the fact that there wasn't a shred of DNA evidence in the house or the garage.


I agree the evidence is very questionable, but I don't believe cops carried out the setup, the evidence points in another direction, to serial killer Edward Wayne Edwards. He performed many murders and setups, such as Laci Peterson / Scott Peterson. A new docu-series is coming, see

http://wbay.com/2016/11/16/manitowoc-co ... d-edwards/



Is there any truth to the rumor I am hearing that it was Edward Wayne Edwards and not Brutus who actually killed Julius Caesar?
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer - Steven Avery, Brendan Dass

Postby Mediocrates » Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:28 pm

Laci Peterson was killed by someone other than her husband? That's not what the jury decided.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer - Steven Avery, Brendan Dass

Postby DeborahK1234 » Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:28 pm

The cat issue alone means this is one case I could not care less to watch. I planned to until I ::covereyes:: read viewer comments.
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer - Steven Avery, Brendan Dass

Postby Krauss von Espy » Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:48 pm

What does this website do for Avery that isn't already being done by his lawyer, Zellner?
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer - Steven Avery, Brendan Dass

Postby Samson » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:22 pm

More positive news, Wayward Son posted this on ISF

7th Circuit affirmed that Dassey's confession was involuntary, upholding the overturning of the conviction. The State looks as though they will appeal yet again.

"The decision of the district court is AFFIRMED in all respects. The writ of habeas corpus is GRANTED unless the State of Wisconsin elects to retry Dassey within 90 days of issuance of this court’s final mandate, or of the Supreme Court’s final mandate.” U.S. Court of Appeals, 7th Circuit, June 22, 2017.

---
"officers try to pin him down on time frames and details, but they are like waves on the sand. Even the State has trouble telling its version of the timeline of the story in any cogent manner due to the fact that it changed with each re‐telling."
Justice is an issue not a word. Find one issue that isn't fair and change that, and that's justice.
Samson
 
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Re: Netflix - Making a Murderer

Postby anonshy » Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:16 am

geebee2 wrote:
Driver-X wrote:Has anyone touched on the fact that:

1) The police dispatch call that positively Identified Theresa's car down to the license plate number days before it turned up in Avery's salvage yard.
2) The fact that there was not one shred of DNA found in the home or the garage where she was supposedly killed.
3) Steven's DNA evidence in the first trail which was kept was tampered with in a way that tells me a syringe was inserted to extract blood which I believe no matter what the FBI claims was used in Theresa's vehicle to Frame Steven.
4)It took 7 separate searches to find the bullet that killed Theresa which by the way is unprecedented in terms of searches because after a search the property is supposed to be released back to its owner which did not happen.
5)how is it that a bullet is found with the victims DNA on it but the rest of the garage is spotless,I mean not one drop of blood was found anywhere not even under the concrete that they removed from the floor which would be scientifically impossible if that truly was the crime scene.
6) The car key, again several searches of the home produced A)absolutely no DNA which again is scientifically impossible if they held her in the house before they killed her,and B) how is it it took several searches to turn up Theresa's car key

I'm sorry but the two defendants were setup by corrupt cops who If I was a lawyer would have crushed during cross-examination especially the dispatch call and the fact that there wasn't a shred of DNA evidence in the house or the garage.


I agree the evidence is very questionable, but I don't believe cops carried out the setup, the evidence points in another direction, to serial killer Edward Wayne Edwards. He performed many murders and setups, such as Laci Peterson / Scott Peterson. A new docu-series is coming, see

http://wbay.com/2016/11/16/manitowoc-co ... d-edwards/


Are you for real? Edwards was 71 and in failing health!

Anon
Half a clue plus half a clue does not equal a whole clue: it equals nothing!
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